Could A Barack Obama Presidency Be A Blessing in Disguse for American Evangelicals?

Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Randy W. Jordan on October 30, 2008 at 5:45pm

Obama will be no blessing, but I'm not sure his opponent will be either.

Sorry to read that Frankie Schaffer doesn't have his fathers wisdom, and has swallowed the "Obama's The Messiah Kool Aid". What dribble based on sound byte marketing. Would that he would have given so much space to the preeminence of Jesus in world.

I am no McCain fan either. I not drinking anybody's Kool Aid. I will probably vote McCain, because as I said on another thread. No Pro-Abort will ever get my vote. I just wish there were real leadership choices. Men with the sense and courage to talk about what is right and do it, not just fill peoples ear with sweet and empty words. I don’t think our founding fathers could have ever imagined a day when principle was overrun by politics every time, the way it is today, nor a time when men valued the immoral and the lie as much as they do the truth.

Here is what I am most thankful for, however. I am glad to know He that rules and reigns the universe and holds everything in his grasp, beholding all from eternity past to eternity future. I am glad to have the understanding that the fate of the world is not determined by economics or madmen Ayatollahs or terrorist. The fate of the world is determined in the purpose and plan of God, and we THE CHURCH, are the prime-determining factor. What God is doing in the earth, and what He going to do, He will do through us. His entire plan and purpose were summed up in Christ Jesus. And, Jesus died not just to save individuals, but to deliver an inheritance to the Father. That inheritance was in the saints (Eph 1:18). It is us! We, the church - the Body of Christ, are to be the fullness of Him who fills all in all. And, as such we are to reveal Christ Jesus in our relationships to one another and the way we relate to the world around us. We are function as the physical manifestation of Jesus on the planet. We ae the first fruits of the restoration of creation. Beyond exhibiting Christ to one another and the world around us., we also display the Kingdom Authority and victory of Christ to principalities and powers in high places. The sooner we give ourselves to moving and growing into the full stature of the man Christ Jesus, the sooner He will be seen as the One true Head of the Church, and He whose government will increase and never end., and the only one worth our campaign efforts.

Vote on Tuesday. Exalt the King day after day as long as it is called today.

Gratefully redeemed,

Randy

Permalink Reply by Kriston Couchey on October 30, 2008 at 6:21pm

I would never pledge allegiance to a lie myself, i don't expect Obama to pledge allegiance to something with an oath the Lord told us never to make.

This nation is:

#1 not under God
#2 does not have liberty and justice for all

i will not bear false witness, why should Obama??

Dena Brehm said:

Ok, this is the final straw. I thought I had read ALL of the worst of the lies being told about Obama, but this one is over the top stupid.
What follows is an email I received from a former neighbor (a guy who said, to my face, in a previous election, "Ok, maybe Jesus wasn't a Republican, but at least He was a conservative!"). I've received numerous anti-Obama emails from him, for months now, and have so far ignored them all, but this one I finally had to respond to. First his email, and then what I wrote (& please *do* check out the Urban Legends link):

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

In a message dated 10/30/2008 3:02:09 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, XXX@XXXX.com writes:

Perhaps there are SOME out there who are beginning to get 'the picture'. The following is a narrative taken from Sunday Morning's televised 'Meet The Press'. and the author is employed by none other than the Washington Post!! Yeah......the Washington Post of New York and Los Angeles Times fame!! Must say that I'm dually impressed..................

From Sunday's Televised 'Meet the Press' Senator Obama was asked

about his stance on the American Flag. Obama Explains National Anthem Stance

Sun, 07 Sept. 2008 11:48:04 EST, General Bill Ginn' USAF (ret.) asked Obama
to explain why he doesn't follow protocol when the National Anthem is played.

The General also stated to the Senator that according to the United States Code,

Title 36, Chapter 10, Sec. 171... During rendition of the national anthem when the flag is displayed, all present except those in uniform are expected to stand at attention facing the flag with the right hand over the heart. At the very least, 'Stand and Face It'

Senator Obama Live on Sunday states, 'As I've said about the flag pin, I don't want to be perceived as taking sides, Obama said. 'There are a lot of people in the world to whom the American flag is a symbol of oppression. And the anthem itself conveys a war-like message. You know, the bombs bursting in air and all. It should be swapped for something less parochial and less bellicose. I like the song 'I'd Like To Teach the World To Sing.' If that were our anthem, then I might salute it.'We should consider to reinvent our National Anthem as well as to redesign our Flag to better offer our enemies hope and love. It's my intention, if elected, to disarm America to the level of acceptance to our Middle East Brethren. If we as a Nation of warring people, should conduct ourselves as the nations of Islam, whereas peace prevails. Perhaps a state or period of mutual concord between our governments. When I become President, I will seek a pact or agreement to end hostilities between those who have been at war or in a state of enmity, and a freedom from
disquieting oppressive thoughts. We as a Nation have placed upon the nations of Islam an unfair injustice. My wife disrespects the Flag for many personal reasons. Together she and I have attended several flag burning ceremonies in the past, many years ago. She has her views and I have mine'. Of course now, I have found myself about to become the President of the United States and I have put aside my hatred. I will use my power to bring CHANGE to this Nation, and offer the people a new path of hope. My wife and I look forward to becoming our Country's First Family. Indeed, CHANGE is about to overwhelm the United States of America.


WHAAAAAAAT the Hell !!!

Yes, ladies and gentlemen, you heard it right. This could possibly be our next President.

I, for one,

Permalink Reply by Dena Brehm on October 30, 2008 at 6:32pm

I just love truth, Claudia.

I try to love people, too, either at the expense of the other wouldn't be Jesus... He IS Truth, and He said He IS the "least of these" (wouldn't we all fit that description?).

So, hopefullly, when I share, you hear kindness in my voice, and a look in my eye that says I'm with you, not against you. The vehemence in me comes from passion, and from having been raised as a lawyer/judge's kid...! Ok, and the kid of a drama-queen, too... what a combo, LOL!

We'll get through this, and it's all, always, working together for our good.

Shalom, Dena

Claudia Labrador said:

Dena,

Thanks for the link. I actually looked at it! I would like to say, though, that I simply stated that Kenya and Hawaii have sealed the record. That is the truth. Why they would have done this just a few days ago--who knows? I don't really care. About the aunt... either way, it's an argument from silence. I guess we'll find out what she has to say, if anything, after the election...

I can always count on you to set me straight. :)

Permalink Reply by Dena Brehm on October 30, 2008 at 6:33pm

POINT!

Your turn with the zinger, girl!

Wow, I'd never thought of it like that ... but I see it.

It's like you, and he, are saying, "hey, the emperor's got no clothes, so I'm not praising his outfit."

Interesting... (keep sharing!)

Shalom, Dena

Kriston Couchey said:

I would never pledge allegiance to a lie myself, i don't expect Obama to pledge allegiance to something with an oath the Lord told us never to make.

This nation is:

#1 not under God
#2 does not have liberty and justice for all

i will not bear false witness, why should Obama??

Dena Brehm said:

Ok, this is the final straw. I thought I had read ALL of the worst of the lies being told about Obama, but this one is over the top stupid.
What follows is an email I received from a former neighbor (a guy who said, to my face, in a previous election, "Ok, maybe Jesus wasn't a Republican, but at least He was a conservative!").

Permalink Reply by Suzette Lambert on October 30, 2008 at 8:04pm

Wow, I have read this whole thread in one sitting, and I am wondering what point to make that has not already been made. Don, you asked if it could be a blessing in disguise. I don't know. And have you all checked your credit card statements lately, because you may have given money to the Obama campaign without knowing it because they took the safety latches off their credit card machine and I heard on TV that a $100 million was done that way, with a countless amount being fraud. Make sure you check your credit cards, especially during September.
Oh, and did you register to vote with Acorn a multiple amount of times, maybe your name went in a dozen times like here in Florida.
I know there have been other incidents of ballot box stuffing in the past, very unfortunate. I feel it is very unfortunate at this time as well.
These are facts I know about the Obama campaign, however not about Obama personally. I am forbidden to speak against the man, however I will not vote for him. I wonder with a campaign like this, how will these people who have done these things be rewarded within the presidency.
How does Obama declare that 95% of Americans will get a tax rebate when 42% pay no taxes at all. That in itself is confusing.
The thing that I find interesting is that we have a president now we are not that thrilled about, and I will admit I have not been all that faithful to pray for him. Even after Father gave me a dream that it was time to pray for him, because if he was not prayed for he would go the way of Pres. Ford and his own father in the legacy he would leave in the eyes of this nation. I wish I knew then what I know now, I would have worked harder at getting people involved. I am thankful my earthly father prays for him.
So, we complain but do we pray? I have been praying for truth and exposure over this election. I want both sides exposed, however I do not appreciate the press taking sides in such an angry manner.
How I feel about Frankie Schaffer sharing his opinion is the same as I feel about Oprah. Everyone has an opinion. Just because someone is a celebrity or sudo celebrity does not mean they have the voice of the Lord for me.
My continual prayer over this is "Thy Kingdom come, thy will be done"

Permalink Reply by DonFeaz on October 31, 2008 at 2:52pm

The church of the Living God transcends John McCain, Barack Obama, any political leader or political system on this earth. Ephesians chapter one bares this out. Our Lord, Jesus Christ sees us as “seated in heavenly places”. We are in the world but not of the world (I john). We are also referred to as pilgrims and strangers whose citizenship is in a city that is made without hands. You could say we are guest workers in whatever country that we live. I had the opportunity to be stationed in two different countries while serving in the U. S. Navy. Though not a citizen of Italy or Spain, I was expected to respect the customs and laws of those lands as well as the laws of the United States. They emphasized our roles as ambassadors for the United States. The Apostle Paul says in the Epistle to the Romans that we are to be godly citizens and respect the authorities that God as sovereign has placed over us. Also II Corinthians calls us ambassadors for Christ. In the United States, the authority placed over us by God is the U.S Constitution. We have been given a representative form of government in which our elected leaders are supposed to derive their authority from the constitution. My personal conviction on this matter is that in good conscience, I should prayerfully vote for the candidate that would best allow me to lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.(I Timothy 2:1,2). Whether you choose to vote for Obama, McCain, another candidate, write in Mickey Mouse or not vote that is between you and the Lord. As believer, I would give you the right hand of fellowship. My original question when I started this discussion was to challenge believers to see Him who is far above no matter who is elected to office. Our trust is in Jesus Christ. He is our only hope. He is the lover of my soul. Yet, believer as humans can get so fixated on politics that if their candidate loses they think that it is over. America is finished. America is in the hand of God to do as He wills as are all nations. Jesus Christ is neither a Republican nor Democrat. He is neither a Conservative, Moderate, Liberal, Socialist nor any other political label men create. He is the King of Kings, Lord of Lords. We that are believers are his beloved children and that is where our trust should rest.

Permalink Reply by Sean Steckbeck on October 31, 2008 at 10:14pm

If I could add one more thing.....

Iran's President Ahmedinijab had an official office prior to his presidency in the 1980's. You know what this office was? The official trainer of the Basiji branch of the military and politics. He is even elected under the Basiji party, and ironically not the mullah's Islamic Revolution party. How many people have heard the name Basiji before concerning Iran?

You got it! THe Basiji children of the Iran-Iraq war of the early 1980's. The Basiji children were those who were trained to go before the army as cannon fodder and mine dummies. These children died by the masses and were used as psychological warfare against the Iraqis who couldn't stand watching it anymore. Guess who was their general and trainer and the mastermind behind this...you got it.... Ahmedinihab before he was president.

They were given keys that were straight to heaven which were put around their neck, and they marched in the name of mahdi (12th secret imam) with NO WEAPONS...just to be cannon fodder and mine dummies. They were 7-12 years old. THink about a 7 year old trained to be cannon fodder.

The children who survived were given scientist scholarships and today are those developing the nukes.

Ahmedi is a mental case beyond that of King Herod I.
He is the head and the mental planner behind the Basijis.

Obama says he believes Ahmedi is pragmatic and wants to "talk" with him.
He wants to have an adult discussion with a mental case who sent thousands of children to their death with keys around their neck.

I trust McCain more!

Permalink Reply by Marshall Diakon on November 1, 2008 at 8:43am

  A brother from a house church in the San Francisco Bay area forwarded this:

I have searched the Scriptures in vain to find an endorsement for electing a leader over me. What I do find is that I am adjured to pray for those over me as servants of God, placed by Him to do His bidding.
The True Word reveals I am to be a stranger here; that like Abraham I simply sojourn upon this earth, my home and land is elsewhere. Paul knew this, he told me to be a good soldier then he told me that a soldier does not “...entangle himself with the affairs of this life; that he may please him who has chosen him to be a soldier.”. Peter knew this as well, he writes to the Ephesians saying our citizenship is in heaven, and that we eagerly await a Savior from there, the Lord Jesus Christ.
Why am I a stranger here? Because God Himself has elected me to be counted amongst His chosen ones!
So what then is my position on elections? I am to make sure of my election and calling, which dictates that I keep myself pure from the world and its corrupted, temporal ways. Making my election sure means to seek and find the calling and position for which He has chosen me and to fulfill it with all my heart. In all honesty I cannot claim to be a very good soldier, but I can claim to be one who tries where I can, and as for me I find it easy to dissociate from this present political system and to set my hope on a new and better place.
I don’t want to elect, I want to be elected!

Permalink Reply by Brother_Jonathan on November 1, 2008 at 12:10pm

Whomever leads a country will not determine the fate of the church. In fact, the church thrives when we're oppressed such as the churches in China. Our Lord raises up nations and brings them down. I just pray that the Saints allegiance are to His Kingdom and that His Kingdom does not depend on anything of this world.... even its leaders. Grace and peace.

Permalink Reply by Brother_Jonathan on November 1, 2008 at 12:11pm

I pray that we discern that the Lord has asked us to build His Kingdom... none other. We are in the world but not of the world. Therefore we aren't called to build up this world of which has been judged but to build up His Kingdom so that we may be ready to receive Him in at His return!

Rick Knock said:

Just a few thoughts about our responsibilities in this life:

Philippians 1:23-24 NLT
I'm torn between two desires: I long to go and be with Christ, which would be far better for me. But for your sakes, it is better that I continue to live.

Philippians 1:28 NLT
Don't be intimidated in any way by your enemies. This will be a sign to them that they are going to be destroyed, but that you are going to be saved, even by God himself.

Philippians 2:15 NLT
Live clean, innocent lives as children of God, shining like bright lights in a world full of crooked and perverse people.

Matthew 5:13-16 NIV
"You are the salt of the earth. But if the salt loses its saltiness, how can it be made salty again? It is no longer good for anything, except to be thrown out and trampled by men. "You are the light of the world. A city on a hill cannot be hidden. Neither do people light a lamp and put it under a bowl. Instead they put it on its stand, and it gives light to everyone in the house. In the same way, let your light shine before men, that they may see your good deeds and praise your Father in heaven.

Matthew 25:26-30 NIV (Re: Investing what God has given to us)
"His master replied, 'You wicked, lazy servant! So you knew that I harvest where I have not sown and gather where I have not scattered seed? Well then, you should have put my money on deposit with the bankers, so that when I returned I would have received it back with interest. "'Take the talent from him and give it to the one who has the ten talents. For everyone who has will be given more, and he will have an abundance. Whoever does not have, even what he has will be taken from him. And throw that worthless servant outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.'

God Bless!

Rick

Permalink Reply by Brother_Jonathan on November 1, 2008 at 12:15pm

The world asks us to vote with our opinions and thoughts; the Lord asks us to vote for Him with our life (soul). I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me. As we know, this world only serves as a distraction to inhibit us from carrying out the Lord's Will. Lord, do come quickly!

Permalink Reply by Kriston Couchey on November 1, 2008 at 1:08pm

Thanx brother Jonathon,

You are speaking MY language now. the language of the Kingdom...

Kris

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