OVER THE HILL??
Our hunger for the Lord and our desire to truly follow Him has taken my husband and me through several different traditional congregations. There have been many reasons for this, the primary one probably being that leadership in several of these have focused on goals or ideas that cannot be found in the Bible. With one notable exception, another common thread has been the obvious exclusion of input from brothers and sisters over 40. Of course there is a surge right now to reach young people since they are the generation who many believe will be here when Jesus returns. That's right and proper; it's always right and proper to encourage young people to encounter the Lord and grow in intimacy with him. However, older believers quite often have real wisdom to impart. Scripture exhorts the older to teach and mentor the younger; but how can this be if seniors are not only not encouraged to make input, but are sometimes purposefully excluded?
My husband and I live in an area where there is no expression of simple church, so we cannot say how it is in a simple church or non-traditional gathering of believers. But those of you who are blessed to be in such a situation -- do you find this to be an issue? What has been the contribution and/or the usefulness of your over-forty brethren? Do you have difficulties or challenges in getting a wide range of ages in those who gather with you? We would love to hear what your experience has been in dealing with "elders".
My husband and I live in an area where there is no expression of simple church, so we cannot say how it is in a simple church or non-traditional gathering of believers. But those of you who are blessed to be in such a situation -- do you find this to be an issue? What has been the contribution and/or the usefulness of your over-forty brethren? Do you have difficulties or challenges in getting a wide range of ages in those who gather with you? We would love to hear what your experience has been in dealing with "elders".
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Dena Brehm on -
As a 47-year old woman, I hear you...!
I do believe we need all ages to be part of the community ... the older ones have hopefully not only lived thorugh many things, but have learned from them. They do have much wisdom to impart.
The younger folks are able to ask "why do we do it that way?" questions, which can keep the older folks from getting stuck in traditional ruts. And within the variety of ages, we have other perspectives -- from different genders, different cultures, different experiences, different viewpoints, different talents, different passions ... all of whom have something vital to contribute to the whole.
We've had everyone from newborns, to toddlers, to school-aged kids, to teens, to young adults, to older adults, to marrieds, to singles, to elderly. Each had something to share. Each was heard, and what they had to say was given consideration.
I also find a tendency to exclude the young (children) ... as if they don't yet have a full-sized version of the Holy Spirit, but some sort of junior-sized version. Balderdash...! Ageism works both ways, it seems. We need to esteem and validate anyone, regardless of age, gender, intellect, experience, perspective. God knows how to sort through and use whatever He chooses.
Anne -- you just freely give what you've got to give, and share who you are. God knows your value, and you do too. Others can discover what a delight you are, as you share yourself.
You go, girl! ;)
Shalom, Dena
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Permalink Reply by Dena Brehm on
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As a 47-year old woman, I hear you...!
I do believe we need all ages to be part of the community ... the older ones have hopefully not only lived thorugh many things, but have learned from them. They do have much wisdom to impart.
The younger folks are able to ask "why do we do it that way?" questions, which can keep the older folks from getting stuck in traditional ruts. And within the variety of ages, we have other perspectives -- from different genders, different cultures, different experiences, different viewpoints, different talents, different passions ... all of whom have something vital to contribute to the whole.
We've had everyone from newborns, to toddlers, to school-aged kids, to teens, to young adults, to older adults, to marrieds, to singles, to elderly. Each had something to share. Each was heard, and what they had to say was given consideration.
I also find a tendency to exclude the young (children) ... as if they don't yet have a full-sized version of the Holy Spirit, but some sort of junior-sized version. Balderdash...! Ageism works both ways, it seems. We need to esteem and validate anyone, regardless of age, gender, intellect, experience, perspective. God knows how to sort through and use whatever He chooses.
Anne -- you just freely give what you've got to give, and share who you are. God knows your value, and you do too. Others can discover what a delight you are, as you share yourself.
You go, girl! ;)
Shalom, Dena
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Permalink Reply by Anne Chick on -
Hi Dena,
Thank you for making input to this discussion -- you make an interesting point about the young children! Several fellowships I've been involved with have really understood that the Holy Spirit is for everybody and have encouraged even the very littlest ones to gain experience praying for others, prophesying and operating in the other gifts of the Spirit. I see it more and more and it encourages me greatly.
As you know, sometimes it can be discouraging to give what you've got to give when nobody is receiving!
Have a joyous Christmas and may you have a very special visitation from the Heart of the Lord this Christmastime!
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Permalink Reply by Dena Brehm on
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Someone is indeed receiving, Anne ... He works all of that out! You just keep giving (& receive from others). :)
Shalom, Dena
Anne Chick said:Hi Dena,
Thank you for making input to this discussion -- you make an interesting point about the young children! Several fellowships I've been involved with have really understood that the Holy Spirit is for everybody and have encouraged even the very littlest ones to gain experience praying for others, prophesying and operating in the other gifts of the Spirit. I see it more and more and it encourages me greatly.
As you know, sometimes it can be discouraging to give what you've got to give when nobody is receiving!
Have a joyous Christmas and may you have a very special visitation from the Heart of the Lord this Christmastime!
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Permalink Reply by Anne Chick on
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That is an excellent reminder, girlfriend!! I know the Holy Spirit was behind your comment...thank you for reminding me that the Lord works in mysterious ways!
Love and blessings in Jesus, peace to you during this busy holiday time,
Anne
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Permalink Reply by Dena Brehm on
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Anne -
I thought of you a little while ago...
Last night, we watched "Horton Hears a Who" (quite a different rendition to the one I watched as a girl, LOL!). My kids commented on not remembering reading that book, and I was aghast! (envision jaw-dropped expression!)
I intended to remedy that today -- and lo and behold, Amazon.com had sent me an email, letting me know that if I purchased 3 Dr. Seuss books, today only, the 3rd would be free. (So, God speaks through Amazon, too.)
I got right on it, and found some wonderful ones that delighted me as a child ... and a new one I was unfamiliar with, but which I'm sure would delight both you and me...!
It's called, "You're Only Old Once: A Book for Obsolete Children", by Dr. Seuss (Theodore Giesel was a follower of Jesus, and used his books to promote His teachings). I ordered it and can't wait to read it -- here's a synopsis:
Subtitled A Book for Obsolete Children, this unusual item in the Seuss canon doesn't really belong among the children's books. Written to celebrate the nonsense master's 82nd birthday, it follows "you" (an elderly gent in a suit and white moustache) through a physical check-up in some fiendish geriatric clinic. You are measured, prodded, and subjected to all the medical indignities familiar and unfamiliar to the elderly. "You must see Dr. Pollen, our Allergy Whiz, who knows every sniffle and itch that there is... He will check your reactions to thumbtacks and glue, catcher's mitts, leaf mould, and cardigans too. Nasturtiums and marble cake, white and blue chalks, anthracite coal and the feathers of hawks." It's clear that the process is going to be long, but much shorter than the bill. The blurb on the back says it all: "Is this a children's book? Well... not immediately. You buy a copy for your child now and you give it to him on his 70th birthday." Actually, it would make an amusing gift for anyone over 40.
Makes me smile...!
I've decided, Anne, that I'm just going to be an ageless enigma -- and let God do what He wants through me -- care to join me...? ;)
(& a very merry Christmas to YOU!)
Shalom, Dena
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Permalink Reply by Anne Chick on
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HALLELUJAH!!!GREAT STRATEGY!!!!
I will have to get ahold of that book!
Have a wonderful Christmas in every way!
Love and blessings,
Anne
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Permalink Reply by Marshall Diakon on -
sister Anne, may Father bless you as you are enduring there; send more of the Family to you -- or you to them..
SimpleChurch doesn't exclude a soul that has been overtaken by the Spirit of Christ, be young or old, rich or poor...
There is a gathering known in Kinston. Grace to you.
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Permalink Reply by Anne Chick on
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Hey Marshall, GREAT NEWS!!! I will check it out! Thank you for this blessing. Grace back to you, in Jesus' Name!!!
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Permalink Reply by Birgit on -
Hi Anne,
I'm 45 so I guess I qualify for the "over the hill" group. :)
I have experienced ageism both concerning young and old people in IC, cell churches, house churches, bible studies and Christian families. It's very frustrating because it's so clear from the Bible that every member of the Body of Christ has a role to play. By your starting this thread a lot of people, including me, are reminded to not disqualify anyone from Christian service. That is wonderful.
I do think that older people are sometimes ignored or minimized because some have been comfortable with being ignored and have a false understanding of retirement. I've seen this complacency in people my age and older. It could also be a lack of self-confidence to speak up (in love of course). Avoiding confrontation at all cost seems to be a very common problem at least in the United States.
I am so glad for older people taking on the role the Bible gives them as Elders, to engage younger people in conversation, model godly living etc. . Not having parents that are believers we need this kind of input for ourselves and our daughter.
Please continue what you are doing.
Birgit
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Permalink Reply by Anne Chick on
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Dear Birgit,
Your words are so encouraging! You have touched on several important streams here, not the least of which is the desire to avoid confrontation. That sure sounds like me!!
One of the other commenters mentioned that so often children are excluded from being part of the fullness of the Body because so many don't think they can minister in the full power of the Spirit. Praise God, I've been connected with many groups that are trying to change that, and I have seen my own grandchildren minister powerfully in the Spirit. It is so rewarding and such a blessing! We ALL have precious gifts to give. May they ALl flow, in Jesus' Name!
Love and blessings in Him,
Anne
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Permalink Reply by Cindy Skillman on -
Hi, Anne
I'm 49, so over that hill soon . . . ;) I'll be glad to be over it, too. Been a very long climb. Not that the downhill side looks easier. Who knew you could get used to hurting all over pretty much all the time?
One thing I've really noticed in the IC is the tendency to toss the older folks out the window when it comes to worship style (and volume). Like everything has to appeal to the younger crowd because they're the ones more likely to be reached by the gospel. If that's the case, we'd better go to all puppet ministry all the time, because it's children, not teens or young adults, who are the easiest to influence.
As you know, there's no SC here, either. Soon, I hope. I'm looking forward to getting together with some local folks in a couple of weeks to discuss and pray together about how God would have us work toward that goal. You have no idea how delighted I am about this development--well, maybe you do.
I do think there's a huge need for the older women (and men) to teach the younger. Especially in our society where extended family frequently live a continent away (or further), young families need our support and can benefit from learning about all the boneheaded things we've done ("Don't do that--it turns out very badly.") so that they can go on and make completely original dumb mistakes rather than repeating the ones we've already done. Not all older folks have a lot to offer, it's true, but even those who've begun to lose the sharp edge of their reasoning abilities can teach us to love and be patient and minister to one another. No one in the body of Christ is without an assignment. We might not have read the duty roster, but we do have a job.
Anyway, don't lose hope, Anne. God does have a ministry and a church family for you and I believe He will lead you to each other. I pray that's what He's doing with us now, but even if not, I know that, in His time, He will.
God bless,
Cindy
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