Religion and Politics
Can a person be a communist and a Christian? How about a Marxist? I am a Canadian, but I am not a Socialist, though we have quite a lot of Socialist programs, education, health care, pensions, welfare, subsidies, grants, and of course, taxes. Just like there are all religions in Canada, there are all political views as well.
Government isn't something I gave a lot of thought to until I began listening to Glenn Beck a few years ago. Then I started reading books like "A Patriot's History of the United States", and "5000 year Leap". Frankly, I am very concerned about the United States, and what will happen after health care is passed this weekend. It's as if President Obama isn't aware there is a war being fought right south of the border in Mexico. I think he is not only undoing America, he is undoing the globe.
We have a real good Prime Minister in Stephen Harper, but I am surprised at how dependent we are becoming on the government. It shouldn't be that way. I don't think God wants us to rely on anyone but him.
America was built upon strong Christian principles. If America gets to the point where the majority of the people become so dependent on Socialism that they choose that over their own independence, we're all doomed to speed down the trail of self-destruction. It is also called self-deception.
What political "belief" are you? Do we actually "believe in" politics as we believe in religion or God? Or is politics something we have to accept and work around in order to hold our religious beliefs?
Views: 5
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Connie on -
I'm in Alberta, where it blizzards one minute, and then returns to spring the next. There are actually 3 Albertas: Northern, Central, and Southern, but the oil industry is working hard to blend us all together. In the South, each little town has its own unique culture. Is it that way in Ontario too?
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Permalink Reply by Joseph Phillips on -
I believe that Religion and Politics are directly related. We are Citizens of the Kingdom, Ambassadors of Christ. Read these two articles to see what I am speaking of.
http://hisholychurch.org/sermon/romans13.php
http://hisholychurch.org/sermon/fatherabba.php - Attachments:
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libertyP.pdf, 74 KB
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Permalink Reply by Rod on -
Hi Connie, I do have political views and recently ran for to be a board member of the Reston Association one of the world's largest. I didn't win but learned some things. 85% of people don't vote. This would include my religious friends some of whom were actually horrified that I would want to get involved. I meet some people who could stand it enough to receive a campaign brochure but not two days it that happened to happen. Ya I got one yesterday they might say with some annoyance.
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Permalink Reply by Connie on
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Hi Rod, maybe 85% of us trust government enough to trust they won't interfere in our lives, so we don't get involved with the unimportant entity that it is supposed to be. While the 85% is going about living their lives, staying out of other people's business, the .005% of those who DO care, and who want to skim all the money off the system are silently, secretly going about their dastardly deeds. But suddenly we, the 85% wake up and say, "we have no industry. we have no jobs. we are out of money." And then a sleuth among us begins digging around in the rubbish, to see why nothing the government does is making sense. He suddenly realizes the elected president has been selected, not elected, and discovers how and why, and what he is doing. And they let him expose them, because it is too late to turn back, because through secret combinations they have infiltrated the religions of America with their "social justice" agenda, and drawn Christians into their web of socialism, communism, marxism mixed with other extremes, calling caring for the poor social justice, when it is a disguise for redistribution of wealth. In fact health care, cap and trade, immigration reform, and other acts which are now called the American act, are all a part of redistribution of wealth, not to Americans, but to a global system, lovingly labelled, "crime inc" by our investigative sleuth.
wake up world
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Permalink Reply by Charlotte on -
Connie, I'm glad you're even asking this question. It's good for discussion and should be discussed.
I have several friends who are Christians but see nothing wrong with socialism. In fact, they almost see it as a mandate that lives out caring for the poor. The problem with this is that scriptures tells us as believers to care for the poor and hungry. Not to make others do so through any channel, including the government. I often think if they themselves were half as diligent in caring for others as they are in their political pursuits, our world would be a lot better off.
There are many reasons for this, but I think it is rooted in the personal interaction that our Lord wants us to have with one another. Government simply cannot provide this.
I had a friend recently lose her husband in death. She shared at a luncheon how much she appreciated people coming by and bringing food and cards, etc. But she said the one thing that meant the most to her was the day, a few weeks after the funeral, when a friend brought lunch over to her, AND STAYED TO EAT IT WITH HER. She said she didn't need food; she need companionship, which is what her friend provided.
This left a huge impact on me and has directly affected many of the things I do since then.
As far as your questions about whether a communist can be a Christian, a true communist cannot, for the very political creed says there is no god. Now, whether those forced to live under communism can be, obviously, yes, but I am sure you realise that.
I would like to say that Jesus has a political system that is best, but to be perfectly honest, I cannot find it anywhere. In fact, I actually find the opposite. That is, that He had no inclinations to be politically involved in any way. His disciples on more than one occasion indicated that they wanted to set Him up and make Him an eartlhy king. He said no way. His kingdom is not of this world. In fact, as difficult as this is, He did not even denounce slavery, something that we certainly agree is evil. But He was very silent on that issue, as on most social issues.
So....my conclusion is that while certainly some political systems more accurately reflect Judeo-Christian ethics, and I prefer to live under them, it does appear that we are to turn to Him even more in those times when tyranny is brought upon us, trusting Him to see us through and to provide. I think your very last question is probably the answer to itself -- ie., yes.
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Permalink Reply by Darren Morrison on -
I herd a great Quote the other day on a Christan Radio Station. Do not remember the speacker but the quote is "it is not Republican vs. Democrate as the media trys to instigate but it is The Goverment agaist the People." Are religous freedoms or freedom of speach and right to keep and bear arms is a obstical for those in power which none of them share are faith as far as I can tell. Yet I still pray for them.
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Permalink Reply by Frank on -
When God created man, he gave him freewill.
Freewill is sacrosanct to God. Freewill means that WE make decisions and WE bear the consequences of them. This is God's way.
The difference between communism/socialism, and democracy/capitalism is defined somewhere on the net as.-
In Socialism/Communism, property and wealth, and the means of creating wealth are in the ownership of the state and or government.
(Or Winston Churchill's once famous description of Socialism, "Socialism, -the equal sharing of misery")
In Democracy/Capitalism, property and wealth, and the means of creating wealth are in the hands of the private individual and corporations.
From these two reasonable definitions, we can see that God given PERSONAL responsibility is stolen by socialism, and invested in our masters. In capitalism, responsibility is retained in private hands to do with as we will. That which we loan to democratic government can be regularly called back to the people, and then loaned to another for a period.
Hence, I consider socialism to be completely anti-God in its source, it's outworking, and its ultimate purpose. It is no coincidence that socialism is atheistic.
Socialism covers its tracks by declaring that the ownership of wealth creation (businesses and property) are actually owned by "the people". In practice this is an absolute lie. Every manifestation of socio/communism has shown that it creates a new ruling class, who violently lord it over the worker/slaves. Additionally they create a fake, one party voting system which can never vote to overturn socialism other than by violence.
Even now, here in the UK, socialism over generations has purchased such a massive voting base that it is almost impossible to overturn. It means that even supposedly right wing parties like the Tories have had to promise socialist agendas in order to win votes. The USA is not far behind.
Those who stand for socialism believe they have an evolutionary right to rule for the benefit of the people, but more honestly, the benefit is for themselves. Every socialist state has had special shops and privileges for the ruling elite. So much for equality!
As far as socialism being a manifestation of Christianity in its caring for the poor etc. God placed that mandate on the individual and the family. Getting the government to take responsibility just enables us to abdicate away from the mandate to love our neighbour.
Socialism has made the destruction of the nuclear family, a major part of it's agenda. Its alternative creation makes the "state" a family. This is doctrine has been slowly manifesting itself for years is even written down in the various socialist manifestos. This is why there is so much intervention by UK and US state officials in family life.
Jesus said that the poor will always be with us. This is not an excuse for ignoring their cries. However, the socialist doctrine of equivalence, means that those who become poor by their own bad, selfish and willful choices, are invariably rescued from their poverty by the sequestering of money (taxes) from those who have taken responsibility in life.
Jesus makes it clear in the parable of the prodigal son, and elsewhere, that rescue is all about repentance. The son was left to his own devices until he repented. Socialism, exactly like today, would have sent social workers into the pigsty to give him money to buy more alcohol and prostitutes. Socialism would have denied the son's own responsibility for his condition. Socialism would have blamed the rich selfish father for the son's state. Socialism would have confiscated the father's land and wealth and given it to everyone who promises to vote for them.
Someone recently said. There are two classes of people. Those who work for a living, and those who vote for a living!
This is a warning to you Americans, from a Brit. I truly love America. Anyone who knows me will readily tell you that I defend the USA regularly from both justified and unjustified condemnation. I love to travel and meet you guys, either in your great country or elsewhere. You have a God given personal freedom which the rest of the world either desires or hates. Don't let your masters continue to take any more of your freedoms away by stealth.
Look at the destruction that socialism has done to the UK since the war. We are an infantile nation now. Where has the "Great" in Great Britain gone. It has been taken by a "Nanny" State. We have generations of adults who suckle at the tit of the state. Every time something is not right, they demand action by government. "The government should do something" is a constant whinge and whine from countless feckless idiots who are bred to be work-shy. This cry is hardly surprising. The promise of the socialists when they came to power after the war was that, "the government will take care of you from the cradle to the grave". Or equally, "THE GOVERNMENT IS YOUR GOD!
The Welfare State of the UK is the third largest employer in the world, behind the Chinese red army, and the Indian National Railway. Look how tiny a country we are, yet the state is monster size.
Guess what? THEY ALL VOTE LABOUR! I wonder why?
The Welfare State has bankrupted us financially, spiritually and morally.
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Permalink Reply by Connie on
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Frank, every word you wrote in your reply resonates with me very deeply. Organized crime has infiltrated our governments, skimming all the wealth it can, mainly from illegal activities. With families destroyed by a drug culture, organized and distributed and encouraged by secret societies with strong financial ties to our government, it is no wonder. Arkansas and the Clinton connection is shocking, if it is true. (the videos are found a few posts down, and once you start listening to them you can't stop, as disgusting as greed is).
To be honest, I don't know if I could vote against our Canadian health care system. You have a similar system in Great Briton. It is hard to know what we need to do to change a system of government that is too far gone now to change, so knowing how it will end is what gives me hope. One thing God has taught me when I've had times in my life that I thought were as bad as they could possibly get, is that at that pivotal point things can actually get worse, and a lot worse. I am glad I have learned that because it helps me to be prepared for life as our governments and churches of the dark side fall. I know that when it gets so bad that I don't think it can get any worse, it will. Big deal. I can work to get prepared by having food and seeds, but it will do me no good if I don't have faith in God. The kind of faith I'm talking about is the faith that leads to repentance. Repentance is how we demonstrate our devotion to God. And how we care for others, not how willing we are to pay tax.
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Permalink Reply by Marshall Diakon on -
may our repentance be thorough, and our passage through the narrow gate safe.
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Permalink Reply by Darren Morrison on
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I was introduced to the idea of house church while involved in political movement. At a pro-gun rally or shall I say pro-freedom. Most of the people I meet though the John Birch Society and the Consutution Party. Those are great places to find like minded people and good strong GOD fearing Christians and not the wishy washy type you find at the mega churches. I could not imagine Christian who were not conservative in some way and perhaps would not want to meet them. There are Marxist who call them selves Christian but then again anyone can call them selves a Christian. But that is not to say that a Marxist can’t get saved.
But we ought to think of Christ in every thing we do. Even in our political realm. I vote according to my belief in GOD’s word so therefore I can not vote for anyone who advocated the killing of the innocent so I can not vote for a so called pro-life candidate. I believe it is biblical to protect yourself and family so I can not vote for a anti-freedom candidate one who doesn’t support the second amendment.
It is the freedoms we enjoy in this country is why American leads the world in sending out missionaries. It is Christian in this country that leads the charge for evangelism around the Globe. America was founded by Christians and our freedoms are a result of that. The persecuted churches in Europe found freedom and that is how were got the Baptist who were once the Anna Baptist, they shaped Christianity in America that has influenced Christians around the world.
My fear is that we are losing that. As we ask for more handouts from big government and not praying to GOD. As we reward the lazy though welfare and steal from the hard working. As we move down the path as a country toward socialism and fascism and move away from GOD. The Christian who remain faithful to GOD will be persecuted once again.
That is why I am interested in the house church movement anyway because I see the political storm on the horizon and it does not look well for us. I have worked on a collage campus and have herd the hate and even calls for violent on conservative Christian they blame us for every thing wrong in the world, including the environment. There hatred towards fundamental Christian is boiling over. Like it or not most of us are the fundament Christians they are taking about. All a fundamental Christian is someone who believes the bible to be the word of GOD in it’s most general term.
Joshua 24:15 And if it seem evil unto you to serve the LORD, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.
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Permalink Reply by Charlotte on
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Frank, this is probably the clearest, most concise, and in summary, best commentary on the differences between
communism/socialism and democracy/captialism that I have read. Thank you for sharing it.
Frank said:When God created man, he gave him freewill.
Freewill is sacrosanct to God. Freewill means that WE make decisions and WE bear the consequences of them. This is God's way.
The difference between communism/socialism, and democracy/capitalism is defined somewhere on the net as.-
In Socialism/Communism, property and wealth, and the means of creating wealth are in the ownership of the state and or government.
(Or Winston Churchill's once famous description of Socialism, "Socialism, -the equal sharing of misery")
In Democracy/Capitalism, property and wealth, and the means of creating wealth are in the hands of the private individual and corporations.
From these two reasonable definitions, we can see that God given PERSONAL responsibility is stolen by socialism, and invested in our masters. In capitalism, responsibility is retained in private hands to do with as we will. That which we loan to democratic government can be regularly called back to the people, and then loaned to another for a period.
Hence, I consider socialism to be completely anti-God in its source, it's outworking, and its ultimate purpose. It is no coincidence that socialism is atheistic.
Socialism covers its tracks by declaring that the ownership of wealth creation (businesses and property) are actually owned by "the people". In practice this is an absolute lie. Every manifestation of socio/communism has shown that it creates a new ruling class, who violently lord it over the worker/slaves. Additionally they create a fake, one party voting system which can never vote to overturn socialism other than by violence.
Even now, here in the UK, socialism over generations has purchased such a massive voting base that it is almost impossible to overturn. It means that even supposedly right wing parties like the Tories have had to promise socialist agendas in order to win votes. The USA is not far behind.
Those who stand for socialism believe they have an evolutionary right to rule for the benefit of the people, but more honestly, the benefit is for themselves. Every socialist state has had special shops and privileges for the ruling elite. So much for equality!
As far as socialism being a manifestation of Christianity in its caring for the poor etc. God placed that mandate on the individual and the family. Getting the government to take responsibility just enables us to abdicate away from the mandate to love our neighbour.
Socialism has made the destruction of the nuclear family, a major part of it's agenda. Its alternative creation makes the "state" a family. This is doctrine has been slowly manifesting itself for years is even written down in the various socialist manifestos. This is why there is so much intervention by UK and US state officials in family life.
Jesus said that the poor will always be with us. This is not an excuse for ignoring their cries. However, the socialist doctrine of equivalence, means that those who become poor by their own bad, selfish and willful choices, are invariably rescued from their poverty by the sequestering of money (taxes) from those who have taken responsibility in life.
Jesus makes it clear in the parable of the prodigal son, and elsewhere, that rescue is all about repentance. The son was left to his own devices until he repented. Socialism, exactly like today, would have sent social workers into the pigsty to give him money to buy more alcohol and prostitutes. Socialism would have denied the son's own responsibility for his condition. Socialism would have blamed the rich selfish father for the son's state. Socialism would have confiscated the father's land and wealth and given it to everyone who promises to vote for them.
Someone recently said. There are two classes of people. Those who work for a living, and those who vote for a living!
This is a warning to you Americans, from a Brit. I truly love America. Anyone who knows me will readily tell you that I defend the USA regularly from both justified and unjustified condemnation. I love to travel and meet you guys, either in your great country or elsewhere. You have a God given personal freedom which the rest of the world either desires or hates. Don't let your masters continue to take any more of your freedoms away by stealth.
Look at the destruction that socialism has done to the UK since the war. We are an infantile nation now. Where has the "Great" in Great Britain gone. It has been taken by a "Nanny" State. We have generations of adults who suckle at the tit of the state. Every time something is not right, they demand action by government. "The government should do something" is a constant whinge and whine from countless feckless idiots who are bred to be work-shy. This cry is hardly surprising. The promise of the socialists when they came to power after the war was that, "the government will take care of you from the cradle to the grave". Or equally, "THE GOVERNMENT IS YOUR GOD!
The Welfare State of the UK is the third largest employer in the world, behind the Chinese red army, and the Indian National Railway. Look how tiny a country we are, yet the state is monster size.
Guess what? THEY ALL VOTE LABOUR! I wonder why?
The Welfare State has bankrupted us financially, spiritually and morally.
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Permalink Reply by Darren Morrison on
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Sorry put pro-life were I should have put pro-choise. I believe infantaside is murder so don'get me wrong becouse I usedthe wrng word.
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